Mazdaspeed Protege Valve Stem Seals.. I need your help.

vierte · Postby **vierte** » Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:14

Sup everyone, it looks like the MSP is getting new valve stem seals. I found out they were bad after switching to synthetic oil and the detergents cleaned all the carbon deposits off the seals and she smokes now. Only problem is.. I don't have a valve spring compressor.. I know harbor freight sells one for dirty cheap.. but I've been told that its too big for protege springs. I thought I would give a shout out and see if anyone has a valve spring compressor they might loan out for a day or 2? I'm in the greeley/fortcollins area and hang around denver frequently.

chickenwafer · Postby **chickenwafer** » Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:14

Are you sure it's not the turbo? I guess the only way to verify it's the valve stem seal, without ripping things apart, would be a cylinder leak down test.

But this is complex valve train motors we're talking about here, so I really have no idea what I'm talking about. Camshaft what??

vierte · Postby **vierte** » Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:14

lol.. maybe I should just REW swap it and call it a day! ... wouldn't have this problem. My first thought was the turbo.. and I considered a gt28 or gt30 but the cost to replace valve stem seals was a little bit less. It puffs smoke at first start up, and after idling for a bit.. but its intermittent and it doesn't smoke in boost. It seems to smoke after sustained vacuum. I also know the cylinder head was from a junk yard motor and has never been gone through.

I'll probably try and replace the stem seals this weekend.. and if that doesn't clear things up I'll do a little more investigation.

Postby **RX-7 Chris** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 9:14

it does sound like valve seals. I just have a HF spring compressor so I guess I'm no help.

chromal · Postby **chromal** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 9:14

Sounds like what my tired 225K honda civic cylinder head is doing sometimes, yes, under sustained vacuum. I noticed that when engine braking long stretches (say, down US-285 or I-70 steep sections W of Denver), when I got back on the gas, it'd visibly burn off oil in the exhaust, and then continue running relatively cleanly. I still haven't gotten around to replacing the valve stem seals to verify the fix, but it makes sense (especially since the car did once overheat a little, right before needing a new head gasket).

I compressed and removed the valve springs on ANOTHER honda cylinder head, off the block and car, and did the valve seal job. It was a pain, I couldn't imagine doing it in-situ on a car, although that is apparently normal practice. While doing it removed from the car, *I* lost count of the number of valve spring retainer clip halves that I caused to fall down oil return drains to the oil pan. I also lost several, flung across the room by spring action. It's not too hard once you get a feel for it, but with anything less than the right tool it'll be hard not to be sloppy. I used the harbor freight tool, which I had bent slightly in a vise to accommodate the smaller valve spring retainer (in this case on a Honda D16-series). It was not the right tool, though I did it twice with it anyway. (Had to reverse the orientation of the changing spring geometry on this particular one, realized I had it backwards after 90% finished reassembling retainers on springs.)

Not to say you might not find oil in the intercooler, too.

vierte · Postby **vierte** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 9:14

I pulled off the intercooler plumbing to check for excessive shaft play and signs of oil but didn't find anything obvious. The Protege head has shim and bucket valves so you don't see the spring, they are down in the head... which is why the harbor freight compressor wont work. Fortunately I think I've figured out a simple way to make a valve spring compressor..

I don't think it will be too bad on the car even though I like to launch small hard to find parts everywhere lol. The tricky part is keeping the valves from falling into the cylinder but there are a couple tricks for that.

Postby **RX-7 Chris** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:14

best way to keep the valve from falling into the cylinder is with compressed air.

vierte · Postby **vierte** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:14

Here is the #4 cylinder plug

The remaining 3 look like this..

This seems to confirm my suspicion that its a valve stem seal. If it were an oil ring I would think it would smoke much more consistently and the rotating assembly only has about 20k on it. It also tells me that its not coming from the turbo.. Going to rip her apart on Sunday if I'm not too hung over from St. Patty's day shenanigans.

Thats how I'm going to keep my valves in the cylinder head.. that is if I can find my compressor hose... if not I will use the Indian rope trick.

vierte · Postby **vierte** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 9:14

Diy valve spring compressor and the indian rope trick. Workspretty slick.. but this is a pain in the @ss.

Postby **RX-7 Chris** » Mon Mar 18, 2013 9:14

hopefully that fixes the problem

vierte · Postby **vierte** » Mon Mar 18, 2013 9:14

Meeee too. As goes most mechanic work.. I just snapped a cam cap bolt off in the cylinder head. :/ luckily I was able to remove it but it will be an hour or so before I can get a replacement bolt. Should know if its fixed in a few hours... fingers crossed.

chickenwafer · Postby **chickenwafer** » Mon Mar 18, 2013 9:14

Good luck man!

vierte · Postby **vierte** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 9:14

well..... she smokes much less now. but isn't fixed. any guesses on whats smoking now? It has the same symptoms but not nearly as severe. Still oiling up the number 4 cylinder plug. The next attempt to fix it will be removing the cylinder head and replacing the gasket and checking head cracks. stupid piston motors...

on a good note.. I guess I'll get the Vert road legal again before that happens. Its about time for some topless turbo fun!

Postby **RX-7 Chris** » Wed Mar 20, 2013 9:14

bad PCV valve is a likely culprit

vierte · Postby **vierte** » Wed Mar 20, 2013 9:14

That possibility was crossed off the list very early on.. the car is no longer equipped with a pvc valve. I did run a can of seafoam through the oil and gas and I didn't get any noticeable smoke on startup or the 40mile drive to work today. It usually lets a good puff out when I start it to leave work.. so I guess I'll see what happens.

Mazdaspeed Protege Valve Stem Seals.. I need your help.

Mazdaspeed Protege Valve Stem Seals.. I need your help.

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